D&D 4e = Earthdawn, Take 2

[stevekenson]

So my gaming group is actually talking about starting up a new game of Earthdawn. This led me to look over my old books once again and, unbidden, my earlier D&D 4e = Earthdawn? post came to mind, as I noticed yet more similarities:

• The heroes are all “adepts” so everyone has powers (known as “talents”) based on their discipline (class) and circle (level). Check. (As an aside, I love how Earthdawn worked the game terminology so you actually could refer to someone in-character as an “Nth Circle (whatever)” because circles were like martial arts belts and people in the world really did use them.)
• Characters have a number of Recovery Tests per day for damage; the healing mechanics, including talent- and magic-based healing, build on this. D&D 4e has “healing surges” which seem to work similarly.
• The astral plane in Earthdawn is a source of magic, but also of monsters and danger. One wonders about the similarity of “places” like the Shadowfell and the Feywild in 4e.

Interesting, no?

On a related note, the Thief discipline in Earthdawn kinda sucks. I had an idea for a Theif character (never played one before in ED) but the discipline is lame. So it’s probably going to be an Air Sailor or Scout for me. Maybe Swordmaster. We’ll see.

Comments

[maliszew.livejournal.com]

Though I can't prove it, I suspect that the Earthdawn connection in 4e is probably a case of delayed independent development. The history of D&D since late 1e has been one of developing game mechanics that were already extant years before and incorporating them into itself. D&D hasn't been an "innovative" game for most of its existence and 4e is very much a part of the D&D tradition in this regard. Most of the things the fanboys are oohing and ahing about are old hat outside of D&D but most D&D players aren't "gamers" in the broad sense, but D&D players, so this stuff really does look new and innovative to them (and possibly even to their designers).

[jediwiker.livejournal.com]

Well said.

JD

[xomec.livejournal.com]

Indeed. I tend to agree.

[louprosperi.livejournal.com]

Hi Steve,

I think you're spot on with these similarities (and those you pointed out in your original D&D 4E=Earthdawn post).

I think James is mostly correct regarding independent development, but there are few other games that I know of that have as many features in common with what we've seen of 4E, so perhaps it appears less innocent than it really is.

Hmmm... maybe WotC should have hired Greg Gorden to help with 4E?

Regarding your related note, can you tell me what is it about the Thief discipline in ED that sucks? I've heard this from other folks and am curious. Honestly it's been so long since I've looked at the game that I may have just forgot. Have you considered going with a human for your thief character so you can take advantage of Versatility to round out any areas that are lacking?

Take Care,

Lou

[xomec.livejournal.com]

Perhaps "sucks" was too strong a word, when what I really meant was "doesn't really fit the kind of character I want." I'm looking for more of the stealthy fighter-type, which I think is better handled by the Scout, whereas the ED Thief is more of a "tomb raider" or "cat burglar" sort. I'm just not interested in all the various trap-related talents, nor things like Fence, not when I could have Avoid Blow at First Circle by playing a Scout!

Definitely playing a human character, because I'm a big fan of Versatility. Although I'm not going to play a Sky Raider, I love the Fireblood talent and want to be able to pick it up.

[louprosperi.livejournal.com]

Ah... that makes sense. And I agree that the Thief is fairly narrow in terms the types of "thiefy" characters it supports.

Take Care,

Lou

[sadrx.livejournal.com]

I've had Earthdawn sitting on my shelf for nearly 15 years, probably since it came out, and it's never given me the inspiration to play it. Are the 2nd and Classic editions big enough improvements to warrant further investigation even if I wasn't too impressed by the original?

[xomec.livejournal.com]

I can't really speak to that as I haven't really delved into either of the new editions of the game. Still, if the original didn't grab you, chances are neither of the remakes will, either.

[sadrx.livejournal.com]

Thanks. I had assumed you were plying one of the revisions.